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Reports of bans

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87 replies to this topic

#41
Robert Falcon

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Are you saying that there's nothing broken in UO and that the game is just fine with nothing worth complaining about?



I'm confuessed? I didn't know this is the broken thread, I thought this was the thread talking about players being banned because they were low life, speedhacking, spineless cheater thread! *walks off rubbing his head in confuession*

#42
Lord Chaos

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Considering its been about bans, reports of them, UHall, Stratics, posters, etc. Its has hardly been a one topic thread, hehehe.

#43
Robert Falcon

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I know, seems it’s hard for people to maintain a single train of thought and focus on one subject. But with that said, I am glad something is happening with those who are unable to play fairly and take away from the gaming experience of others, this is long over do!

#44
Silverfoot

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I know, seems it’s hard for people to maintain a single train of thought and focus on one subject.


Anyone have a spare ale?

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Send lawyers, guns and money
The crap has hit the fan
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#45
Lord Chaos

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I know, seems it’s hard for people to maintain a single train of thought and focus on one subject.


As a male, I think you'll only be able to get me to maintain a single train of thought and focus on one subject if you show me boobs (good female ones) or give me beer. :cool

#46
Galen

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I believe the reports.

I believe they were banned for using two specific illegal programs. (Are we allowed to name the programs here?)

Some on the threads have admitted to using one, and/or haven't denied using the other.

While I believe the report, I note that nothing in the report constitutes a "drove."

Indeed I bet there's very few accounts at issue here.

Anyone who uses illegal programs? I'd stop. Not just stop using them unattended. But stop using them at all.

-Galen's player

#47
WatFATnight

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I believe the reports.

I believe they were banned for using two specific illegal programs. (Are we allowed to name the programs here?)

Some on the threads have admitted to using one, and/or haven't denied using the other.

While I believe the report, I note that nothing in the report constitutes a "drove."

Indeed I bet there's very few accounts at issue here.

Anyone who uses illegal programs? I'd stop. Not just stop using them unattended. But stop using them at all.

-Galen's player


What programs would you be referring to?

#48
Nimuaq

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Any third party program except UO Pro programs like UOAssist and UOAutoMap (also UOCartographer). Speed and resource gathering scripts/programs should be on the top of the list.

I'll be honest with you: I'm using a program called Vista that gives me the unfair advantage of better observing the enviroment in uo. It basically freezes the screen every five seconds so that I can check the creatures, houses and items for a longer period. Its best feature is seeing the arrows and spells in mid air!

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
..I, like you, once desired my freedom from the limits placed on me. I watched in disgust as this world became engrossed with the preaching of virtue and none of the practice..


#49
Pitr

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Bannings confirmed on my shard:
- perma banned accounts x13
- 72 hour bans x7

(some of the pvpers will be back this Monday, I mention this because Felucca has been COMPLETELY empty)
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

#50
Belanos

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It might have already been said, but even so it needs to be said again.

hahahahahahahahahahaha its about f*ing time.

I haven't seen a ban wave since that imprisoned dog thing a while back
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... it's pronounced 'fel-ookah', not 'fel-oosha' ...

#51
Robert Falcon

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Bannings confirmed on my shard:
- perma banned accounts x13
- 72 hour bans x7

(some of the pvpers will be back this Monday, I mention this because Felucca has been COMPLETELY empty)


I do have one question? How do you know this information, is there a site or something or is it word of mouth? To know the numbers and types of bans?

#52
Yelena

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in my experiance of pitr the information gathered will be correct because he has a huge hidden information network of players all giving him information.... in the time i have known him even i haven't fully uncovered just how big his politicing and info gathering networks are truely are.... he is worse then santa with the saying he sees you when your sleeping and knows when your awake....

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Death comes in so meny forms and I know quite a few of them....http://img204.imageshack.us/i/yelenasig.jpg/


#53
Galen

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What programs would you be referring to?


There's a lot of confusion on this point. People think there's a "disapproved list" that's being kept a secret, and that anything else is allowed. But in fact it's the opposite and always has been.

And let me say that I'm very sorry I can't provide links for this stuff. This represents only my accumulated knowledge. Also, in this post I address the bannings more generally. I apologize for the length of this post and please bring any inaccuracies to my attention.

Programs not on the approved list that interact with the game, or the client, or with the data stream are not allowed.

Certain programs don't need to be on the approved list because they don't actually do anything with the client data or the data stream. ICQ is allowed; it doesn't have anything to do with UO. Inside UO doesn't actually do anything to UO, it just lets you look at UO files easier. UO:Cartographer just presented map files that were already on the computer, and then kept track of but didn't alter data on your computer that related to where you were in-game. It didn't actually poke into the data stream, let alone modify it. And besides, it's since been approved by the Producer anyway. So now it's on both the "not needing approval" and "explicitly approved" lists.

Programs on the approved lists include UO Assist (which most everyone knows about), UO AutoMap (which has since been supplanted by UO:Cartographer anyway), and a few others.

Speeder XP is a program that its users claimed didn't do anything with the UO Client or the data stream (just over-clocked your processor), but EA said it investigated and it actually DID invade the data stream to do stuff. Thus, it's not allowed, just by definition. Sure, EA might have been lying. But, even though it was my long-time nemesis Wilki who delivered this message on Stratics, I don't think they were lying.

UO Razor is used on free shards to do what UO Assist does. However it can also do a lot more. For example it was used to change clothes really fast, long before the Enhanced Client made this ability a lot more common. However, even if you're just using Razor as "cheaper UOA," and not taking advantage of its other features, it's still not allowed because it interacts with the client and/or the data stream and it's not on the approved list.

Some people use Razor to help in house design and screencap editing and stuff, but not while the UO client is running, thus not actually messing with the client or the data stream. This use is apparently approved, if only tacitly. But personally it'd make me nervous.

Many otherwise-honest players I've known allow themselves to use UO Loop. This is a "repeat macro" utility that hitches itself to UOA. Word is, indeed, that it originally was a part of UOA but EA didn't approve it, fearing (correctly) that it'd lead to unattended macroing. Again, this program does stuff with the client and the data stream (even if indirectly, through UOA) and this requires approval to use. It doesn't have said approval.

Now, as to the recent bannings.....

Based on what's been said on Stratics and research I did on other message boards, the people were banned for the use of 2 programs. One is Easy UO, also known as "the scripting program." Easy UO is used in PvP for a variety of things.

Using Easy UO you can, according to its own documentation, automate pretty much any function in the game. People use it to make bucklers for donation, to train skills, to auto-heal without so much as lifting a finger (a tremendous advantage in any fight, PvP or PvM), to auto-target, to run scripted bots that gather information on vendor prices (hence the vendor database programs), gather and fill and turn-in Bulk Orders Deeds without any user attention whatsoever, loot specific items off of monsters, auto-insure stuff so there's no worry of losing something because you forgot to insure it, cast e-fields at the Shadowlords stronghold with a precision that only a computer can manage and while your other characters perform other functions, to script-discord a Peerless monster on a secondary character while your primary character (usually your Sampire) wastes it, etc.

It is a tremendous advantage and it's been very sad to see this program not addressed for so long.

Another program they banned for, based on the statements of those who were banned and their friends, is Cheat Engine.

Cheat Engine allows for the manipulation of client-side data, which, it turns out, includes movement to a degree (hence it's been used for speed-hacking). (I'd thought it was just for the manipulation of numerical data, but it turns out that's just the tip of the iceberg. Anything in your active memory can be altered, supposedly, by this thing.) I'm positive it's used for even more things than movement but I'm afraid I don't know the details. The potential, however, is tremendous and it's depressing to know this thing has been around. It doesn't seem to be new either.

Other MMOs are nearly-impervious to Cheat Engine. UO isn't.

So based on what I have read, people were banned for using Cheat Engine and for "excessive" use of Easy UO.

Given that many of the bannings occurred during a Harrower fight? Well, that can to my mind ONLY be an intended message sent by EA. An intent to make PvP combat "cleaner." And their saying "we are, literally, watching." In terms of the actualy cheat-bannings themselves, it sounds like it was a beautifully planned and executed operation.

EA muddied the waters, though, by sending out the same form letter to the banned that it sent out for unattended macroing bannings! Thus creating the perception that "UO is banning for unattended macroing." While unattended macroing using Easy UO may be one of the things these people have done, I'm betting it wasn't the only one.

This was very stupid on EA's part and while they deserve praise for the bannings, they deserve to be smacked hard for sending out the same stupid form letter that they send out for less serious offenses.

As to the merits of the bannings themselves: I have yet to see a person who was banned explicitly deny guilt. Maybe I'm just missing it. In fact I've yet to see anyone who was banned during that fight come out and say "I wasn't doing anything wrong during that actual fight." Again, maybe I'm missing it. And I don't want to accuse anyone, I am just reporting on what I have read.

But on a PvP-oriented message board I looked at, while there were some complaints about the lack of an explicit warning, I didn't see anyone saying "I was banned unjustly." They have mostly just objected to the procedure (inaccurate and impersonal form letter, lack of explicit warning, etc.).

One final point. I may address this more fully in another post, but I probably won't. Cheating wasn't the only explanation for performance differences in Felucca. So, even if they cleaned up cheating entirely, don't be surprised if there are no major balance of power shifts in Fel. We'll see.

-Galen's player

#54
Oriana

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in my experiance of pitr the information gathered will be correct because he has a huge hidden information network of players all giving him information.... in the time i have known him even i haven't fully uncovered just how big his politicing and info gathering networks are truely are.... he is worse then santa with the saying he sees you when your sleeping and knows when your awake....


Santa Pitr :)

*laughing*

"So be good for goodness' sake!"

#55
Robert Falcon

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Well thank you for that insight.. Ho ho ho ho

#56
Robert Falcon

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Ok another dumb question! Easy UO I have seen players use it to run scripts to check armor to see what they need to improve, also seen them use it in there homes, to improve skills. Now at they time I saw this, they were "attending" their char. Is this still frowned on or is it the Unattended? Because I would like to warn my friends if they are going to get banned for doing something as silly as adding a few points to their skills.

I understand that wrong is wrong but as in life, somethings are worse then others!

#57
CescoAiel

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Anything not on the approved list is NOT approved... Simple as that...

Whether EA/Mythic decide to act on them is anyone's guess, obviously!
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#58
Adam

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What Cesco said heh

EA says a lot of things, it's mostly to frighten people into not using said software.

I forget how many times they claim to be "acting" on freeshards and are going to bring them down, yet, 10 years later, none have even been approached as far as I know, heh.

#59
CescoAiel

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It may actually be too late for them to act on freeshards... They've neglected that aspect of their ToU and trademark for so long, the courts may decide AGAINTS them, which would open a whole'nother can'o'worms they don't want opened...
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#60
Galen

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Ok another dumb question! Easy UO I have seen players use it to run scripts to check armor to see what they need to improve, also seen them use it in there homes, to improve skills. Now at they time I saw this, they were "attending" their char. Is this still frowned on or is it the Unattended? Because I would like to warn my friends if they are going to get banned for doing something as silly as adding a few points to their skills.

I understand that wrong is wrong but as in life, somethings are worse then others!


In theory the use of Easy UO with UO, regardless of what for, is completely unauthorized and subject to penalties.

Easy UO claims that there's no way to detect it unless you are doing it unattended.

This appears to not be true anymore, however. Either EA is detecting it, or they've gotten very good at inferring its use from the server-side based on in-game behavior, including having figured out a way to account for how many of the scripts try to duplicate the imperfection of how actual players behave (pauses and stuff).

I find it very unlikely that UO is going to ban for every use of Easy UO; their own statements to the banned have cited "excessive" use. While I don't believe Easy UO has anywhere near the number of users they claim, the # of people who've at least tried it once might be prohibitive, and besides....It strikes me, and probably the team too, as being unfair to ban occasional users. We've all gotten frustrated with the lack of action before and some have responded by giving in.

Problem is we can't know their standard for "excessive." So it's best to not use it at all.

What they need to do is release some information on what they did, to at least slow down the crazy rhetoric on Stratics.

To be blunt, I'd be doing a lot more on their behalf on Stratics had they not insulted me multiple times.

-Galen's player