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Ultima Cycles

- - - - - cycles ultima

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33 replies to this topic

#1
Pitr

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Greetings... I have been playing UO since 97.
My search for knowledge and everything related to this game can be sometimes... overwhelming.


A- Skill Training Cycles:
...

(Here the players maximize their skills)


B- Crafting Cycles:
Gather resources (wood, reags, scrolls, ore...),
Gather bods,
Fill bods,
Complete Heartwood Quests,...

(Here the players create slayer speelbooks, special weapons, armor...)


C- PVM Cycles:
Camp a Monster site, collect gold/silver/items... send to bank,
Train a New Pet,

(Here the players collect some extra gear and finish their pets...)


D- PVP Cycles:
One on one tactics,
Gnk tactics,
Stealth Tactics,
Team Work,

(Here the players learn to survive and work together/or not...)


E- Selling Cycles:
Craft items and place them in vendors,
In UO you can sell almost anything... so anything goes,




Now the Sad part...

New players do all of the above using the game rules.
Some veterans... the same.

I have been on 12 shards for the past 11 years and joined the major guilds on each shard...

Everyone of them teaches how to do all of the above cycles in a fully automated way... everyone of them.


Then I take a step back and I see:

- The majority of the players in Trammel... bickering about guild politics, hunting spots... penuts! How can they be so blind to everything? Are they?

- Many crafters working 24/7 on their shops.

- The fellucan guilds that are all about pvp, having Luna shops and online sites selling all the power and stat scrolls, but after joining them for 6-8 months it is easy to see that EVERY tool is used to control the champ spawns... some used numbers, decreasing the individual profit but making sure no other guild would fight for the spawns... aka zerg, but even those have the private boards with cheats and speed add-ons.



Are most of the players blind to the unfairness and discrimination they are subject to?
Unless they cheat or come up with a plan... they are stuck in Trammel or dead in Felluca.
Of course they can join those guilds... and the majority does... a few dont.



I dont... at least not for profit... but yes, for knowledge... and it has been a wild ride.


So my questions today are...

How long does a "Ultima Cycle" lasts?
How long will we see this "Apartheid" and Blindness?



Thank You.


PS: Many of the UO players do everything fair and square... from crafting to owning other players in pvp... those deserve all of my respect.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

#2
Corvak

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Probably until the game dies. EA can't enforce scripting rules correctly without rewriting the 2d client. And they can't rewrite the 2d client without inciting rage from the community.

Newer games enforce these rules better, often because they build more logging and detection into the game engine.

#3
ilikeuo

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I have never heard of these automated ways... is it like a script, something automatic? Sorry, I'm so clueless.

#4
Guum

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Probably until the game dies. EA can't enforce scripting rules correctly without rewriting the 2d client. And they can't rewrite the 2d client without inciting rage from the community.

Newer games enforce these rules better, often because they build more logging and detection into the game engine.


The (not too far-fetched IMO) conspiracy theory is that, counting 'casual' ones, scripters make up such a large percentage of the playerbase that EA won't get rid of them -- it would be too big a hit, financially, maybe even enough to make the game unprofitable. While I don't think that automated playing is a boon to any game, MMOs kinda invite it by being so grind-oriented. Which, again, is a result of economics: reduce the grind, and players see all that there is to see quicker, and subscriptions last a shorter period of time than they ultimately could. The whole thing's a vicious cycle, and monthly fees & the profit model they represent are the ultimate cause of a lot of unpleasantness both on the part of how players play the game and how designers design it.

All that being given (and unalterable, at least in the case of UO), the intelligent course here would be to enforce a policy of disallowing *unattended* macroing/scripting. The programs themselves are here to stay -- even if the 2d client goes away, it won't be long before there's a 3d program to accomplish the same thing. At least by cracking down on unattended use the 24/7ers will disappear. I played a game (for several years, actually) with this policy -- scripting was allowed (good thing too, because that was a seriously click-intensive game), but if you were caught doing it unattended, you'd be banned. I dislike game design that is repetitive enough to where scripting would even be desirable from a lazy player's perspective, but that particular game's policy worked: everyone scripted, but *no one* did it unattended. Unlike in UO, where they do it right in the middle of Luna.

#5
Pitr

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I have never heard of these automated ways... is it like a script, something automatic? Sorry, I'm so clueless.



So are the majority of the new players... and many times I wonder if I am doing the right thing by bringing awareness...

I'm sorry.
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#6
Tabbitha

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Greetings... I have been playing UO since 97.
My search for knowledge and everything related to this game can be sometimes... overwhelming.

PS: Many of the UO players do everything fair and square... from crafting to owning other players in pvp... those deserve all of my respect.


I played on Europa about 7 yrs.I was driven by storylines and RP.

When that died off so did my interest in the game.

To me it just became a haven for Pvp and cheats and that held no interest for ,sadly,so I left.

UO IS a great game if you fall into some of the categories you mention.

Sadly that was its downfall for a lot of people who just upped and left :(

#7
Tancred RedStar

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I'm not sure I see what the "Apartheid" in Felucca.

Felucca is wild and wooly, anything goes and usually does. It is full of risk and reward, perhaps what people don't like is when they lose the risk and don't get the reward. All the same, Felucca is only a small portion of the entire world. Let it be. If someone doesn't relish life on the frontier, they have the whole rest 80% of Sosaria in perfect safety from other players.

As for the outdated skill-gain vs. player capability model, it's outdated. No one wants to spend their free/play time hitting the same keys over and over for hours on end. Surely, for those who have endured, it is an accomplishment - but to what? That they can mindless tap two or three keys over and over for hours and hours on end? In years past, when I got home, alone, lol, at 2 or 3 AM, I would sometimes log on and work skills while drunk. It just seemed like a good way to pass the time and get some "work" done before passing out. Nonetheless, this outdated skill-gain vs. player capability model only encourages people to look for shortcut/macroing/"cheating".

This should be addressed, but would also be a core change for UO from it's entire life.

Perhaps skills should be less focused upon, like some other games, like WoW, where gaining a weapon skill is easily accomplished but capped by level and is pretty much not even a consideration as a skill tree choice or armor set choice.

While some may like it, I don't like that idea, so here's another: Slightly increase the success/gain coefficient in the skillgain function so gains come faster, but perhaps also cap them per day like Siege.

Ok, not a huge fan of that idea either, here's another: dump GGS(nothing in life is guaranteed, esp apparent after the global financial meltdown, right?) and keep the skillgain rate where it is, but offer alternative ways to gain skill. Setup/Create quests with NPC's that can be challenging and interactive and perhaps not so wiki-able(lol) and the rewards are skillgain itself.

"You must be at least 85 Carpentry to undertake this quest"

"You must gather the following goods to construct this item"
<long list of items, some rare, some common>

<throw in deltas for success/failure>
The paint didn't dry evenly
The wood cracked on the edge
The resin has bonded securely
You cut the wood exposing the grain perfectly

<after some time, either hours or dayslong waitperiod>
"You have constructed a Masterpiece! Your skill has increased to 90, you are now a Master Carpenter"

Just some thoughts, but clearly UO has changed over the years and need to keep changing, remain innovative, not just to survive(itself admirable after so many years) but also to grow again.

#8
Mathena

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Felucca is wild and wooly, anything goes and usually does. It is full of risk and reward, perhaps what people don't like is when they lose the risk and don't get the reward. All the same, Felucca is only a small portion of the entire world. Let it be. If someone doesn't relish life on the frontier, they have the whole rest 80% of Sosaria in perfect safety from other players.


I don't mind taking the risk, but what I do mind is feeling like i'm taking the lamb to the slaughter. I have no problem learning the skills to live on the frontier, but when I have to use programs that are against EA's TOS to even compete, then that is no longer an in-game risk. That puts what I have worked to gain in this game in jeapordy. So, either EA needs to allow scripts for everyone or put proper procedures in place to disallow programs like razor.
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#9
Tancred RedStar

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I completely agree with your sentiment. On the other hand, there is no way any game is 100% completely free of exploits, scriptors or cheating in general.

In my opinion, while there is still much to be accomplished, UO has come a long way in combatting cheating and such in the past two years.

In terms of simply being outnumbered, with the consideration that everything is kosher, well that's just a reason to find or make friends and allies. Not everyone in Fel is a cheater, not by a long stretch.

I don't mind taking the risk, but what I do mind is feeling like i'm taking the lamb to the slaughter. I have no problem learning the skills to live on the frontier, but when I have to use programs that are against EA's TOS to even compete, then that is no longer an in-game risk. That puts what I have worked to gain in this game in jeapordy. So, either EA needs to allow scripts for everyone or put proper procedures in place to disallow programs like razor.



#10
Corvak

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I think the number one reason I stay out of fel is the insurance bug, not scripters.

#11
Adam

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Unfortunatly, despite the insurance bug being around for how long now? 6 years? It still hasn't been identified, nor fixed.
That to me was one of the major influences in me not coming back, tbh
There were several times I'd died (especially when provoking shadow wyrms heh) and found items on my corpse with the "Insured" tag, despite having a few millon GP in the bank.

#12
Ferenhelm

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I kinda makes it true to life, maybe they should make a Lawyer skill to dispute Insurance claims.

#13
Corvak

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I mostly stayed back in uo because I met my guild/alliance and theyre all awesome people. I have no interest in PvP though. A worthwhile item insurance system is required for it to be viable due to the game being item based (old school pvp worked without insurance because your gear came from player crafters, not farming bosses for rare drops)

I prefer the 'house rules' the RP guilds on my server run, which is basically just fighting in character or under a guild war using GM crafted armor.

#14
JCtheBuilder

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Probably until the game dies. EA can't enforce scripting rules correctly without rewriting the 2d client. And they can't rewrite the 2d client without inciting rage from the community.

Newer games enforce these rules better, often because they build more logging and detection into the game engine.

This is all false.

The only thing a new client will do is require someone to make a new scripting program for it. Virtually every MMO out there has a script program designed to work with it, even World of Warcraft.

Darkfall just came out two months ago and it has scripts, flying boats, invisibility hacks, teleport hacks, hide in wall bugs, etc. Newer clients are just as susceptible to hacking. UO might actually have a leg up on all new games because the client has been patched for the past 12 years. The older the client, the more secure over time it will get.
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#15
Pitr

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How do you think we can fix this JC?

Allow UO to have inner scripts made by the players like in WoW?
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#16
Corvak

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Probably right JC. I just want them to code a client that isn't a memory hog.

Aside from throwing money at the problem (Hiring an army of GMs) you can't fix it.

#17
Farsight

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I'm not JC, but I will field the question anyway.

As a player, we can report the bugs and exploits and programs via the proper channels and ask the developers to work on them.

We can also refuse to deal with the people whom we know are using dishonest methods in order to get ahead in the game. This is the tough part, since there's no way of telling if the vendor you're buying that power scroll from is an honest or dishonest player. The best ways around this is to either get everything yourself (my preferred method) or to know your source.

But unless we can find a way to get players to organize a mass boycott of the people who script resources, sell gold, script their PvP etc, there's little we can do about them.

If they can get ahead by cheating, then they will. I can't see any way around that.

#18
Pitr

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But unless we can find a way to get players to organize a mass boycott of the people who script resources, sell gold, script their PvP etc, there's little we can do about them.


Hum...

- create a Trammel Alliance that is aware of this problem... so we get everything by ourselves.
- make sure we can get scrolls on our home shard or on another.
- unite that Alliance with the guilds that do not raid and fight for what is right...

Familiar concept? =)
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#19
Corvak

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Farsight, knowing your source is incredibly difficult these days, Luna being what it is, has killed most of the old ways of buying stuff.

The only people who sell person to person are scammers and spammers in Luna bank now.

#20
Pitr

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WBB Contest
New WBB.
Luna Invaded.

Market Equity.
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Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: cycles, ultima