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Old 20th November 2007, 01:53 PM   #1
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Derision is just too darn easy.

It's always much easier to gather public opinion on the negative side of things. Being against the many policies of today's society, I find myself being very, very derisive about RL. But when it comes to less serious matters such as games or amusements or fashion in general, I find myself leaning towards the bleh . indecision or marked approval.

Most people within this rather small community of ours prefers the old 2D client over any new system. I have vague inklings that this preference adheres to a standard set by Diablo. I can remember seeing some graphics for EverQuest while actually playing a demo of the game and thinking.... well... That s***t was funny. It had almost nothing to do with fantasy, looked too alien and remote.

When I first played UO, I can remember going from West Britain Bank to the graveyard, fighting alongside other newbies as we battled the undead. If I got hurt, I'd run away and wait for my stamina to passively replenish itself. It took me a while to learn about the existence of bandages or the healing skill.

I was so naive that after targetting a monster, I'd constantly fast-click my mouse button to continue fighting. I remember one time dying and running to the smithy shop where some people wearing deer antlers which I vaguely noted to be mages were at. It took them awhile to res me, so when I got back to my corpse it had been looted by a char named "newbie" who cussed me out, tossed down a fel stone, and dared me to duel him in fel.

Apart from the remisence, I look back on the past couple years of play. Graveyards? Empty but the undead. Smithies selling their wares at the smithy shops? Gone. Spammers at Brit bank? I'm now trying to compete with them trying to sell the pathetic scraps I might have that possibly could be worth something. I can't haggle on my own favor.

Anyway, back to derision. UO as necesarry has adapted. So have I these past seven years. Originally, I didn't like the Third Dawn client. My computer's specs wouldn't support it. Then again, I had the crappiest computer Gateway had possibly made. When I upgraded to my now old Dell Dimension 4600, I could play it. It looked neat. Sadly, that client was canned due to the majority people's derisiveness. What keeps me playing UO? The hopes of new skills, new lands to explore, possibly new alliances? New loot? Hardly.

I've heard many times TD called "amateurish." The same has been said for KR. But I have to sit back and think "well, I'm not even an amateur programmer." And how many of you have better experience or are more learned than I? What I most liked about TD was being a ghost. If you hadn't seen it for yourself, I pity you. It was far more etheral. You walked about in a fog of blue smoke, a small aura of light surrounding your ghostly self. I'll see if I can find some old pictures. On the otherhand, being dead in KR looks butt-ugly.

I've seen amazing things in games in the past. Take Celda... excuse me.. Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker for Game Cube or its companion piece Twilight Princess. Even on Game Cube, TP looks awesome.

What I dislike about KR is that being dead is ugly. Too many over-exposed whites and grays. It looks much worse than a simple monochrome. I also don't like how I keep lagging on it. I'd stand still, walking or running my mount in place. It's like I downgraded back to that old Gateway. I also couldn't part out some reagents. It gave me an option to select 100 out of 3000 pig iron, but then wouldn't let me pick up just the 100 pig iron, leaving the 3000 still on the ground. WTH? And context menus are activated by a SHIFT and RIGHT CLICK, not the customary SHIFTand LEFT CLICK. Apart from those things, I find myself liking Kingdom Reborn.

But then I read people saying they'd rather tear their eyeballs out with rusty spoons because they don't want to look at KR. What? It's not THAT bad.
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Old 20th November 2007, 02:00 PM   #2
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

For my own part, it is less derision than experienced let down. For the year of development, it is still a largely unplayable client. Plus the repetition of the exact same mistakes in development and release as were made in UO:TD. I am MORE disappointed in the staff I pay to entertain me and their inability to apply costly lessons from the past to today's problems.

Self-mutiliation, especially gouging my eyes out would prevent me form playing other games.

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Old 20th November 2007, 02:26 PM   #3
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

But who is responcible for KR? Certainly not the same people who were invested with TD. Eh? I heard it was Mythic's staff.
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Old 20th November 2007, 09:16 PM   #4
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

KR was in development long before the merger.

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Old 22nd November 2007, 12:39 PM   #5
 
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

My friend, bear in mind that it's not so much whether KR looks "good" or "bad"; that kind of opinion it pointless and useless. The problem with KR graphics is that they are not consistent with 2D graphics. Too many things look "different", in how they are drawn. For example, the swamp dragon has four legs as opposed to the 2D swamp dragon's six legs. A headless is carrying its head as opposed to the completely headless 2D version. Even little things like how avatars hold two handed weapons are different.

I am a firm believer that is possible to bring improvements to a game or system without the sweeping changes and reform. We shouldn't have to change the way we play, and we shouldn't have to adjust. Call the graphics quality, or call them junk; in the end it doesn't matter.

Some players simply will not be bothered to adjust for this game, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. With that said, however, is it derisive to ask for improvements as opposed to change? That is the question. In the end, I think that is the core of most 2Der's feelings against KR, whether they know it or not. Trust me, we all want a new, awesome client. Just didn't want it to be so drastically different from the 2D client.

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Old 22nd November 2007, 01:02 PM   #6
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deraj View Post
The problem with KR graphics is that they are not consistent with 2D graphics. Too many things look "different", in how they are drawn.
Quote:

Even little things like how avatars hold two handed weapons are different.
I've seen my character "holding" a xbow. Well, the xbow seemed to be pinned to her chest because it was no where near her hands. Thanks for reminding about how wierd that one looked.

Quote:
I am a firm believer that is possible to bring improvements to a game or system without the sweeping changes and reform. We shouldn't have to change the way we play, and we shouldn't have to adjust.
Taking this aside, we then have...

Quote:
Trust me, we all want a new, awesome client. Just didn't want it to be so drastically different from the 2D client.
Well, it doesn't seem at all that people do want a different client. The Third Dawn client fell by the wayside. EA itself is so incensed by our lack of use of KR that they toss a survey in our faces demanding of us questions about why we don't use it. How dare we not?

And given the answers people gave, they decided to patch the KR client with "legacy" stuff. Sure, a lot of the stuff is ugly and disproportioned. But perhaps the current player base isn't the primary target for KR? Maybe it is intended to lure people away from WoW or LOTRO?

Sure, it's isometric, but it does look good with 3D chars, doesn't it?

Anyway, without sweeping changes throughout the years, UO wouldn't be celebrating a ten year anniversary. It wouldn't have celebrated a seventh even.
They had to change the game periodically. Funny thing is, I still have problems accepting "artifacts." What amused me is that I spent several hours putting together the meager amount of gold it took to buy a soul seeker. When I bought it, the system message was "you bought a Radiant Scimitar with your money" or something like that. Funny. Funny.

I miss the bygone days when the only difference between valorite and iron armor was the color, not the stats. But I have adapted. What best can be said of UO 2D? It is the game that would run on just about any computer and even on a lowly 56k connection. Sure, there will be lag, but atleast you can login and play the darn thing.

Too many things are different you say. And I agree. IF things stayed the SAME for all this time, who would be playing this game at all if anyone? Half a dozen beta testers?

Now if you'll excuse me, I'll go back to sulking over the fact that UXO was never released.


Oh how I'd like to see that ettin knocked off that bridge.

Last edited by facattac; 22nd November 2007 at 01:06 PM..
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Old 22nd November 2007, 01:14 PM   #7
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

System specs!

My old Gateway.

My Dell 4600.

Marvel at the amazing "Flextastic" Essentail 866!


Last edited by facattac; 22nd November 2007 at 01:17 PM..
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Old 22nd November 2007, 04:26 PM   #8
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

Quote:
tossed down a fel stone, and dared me to duel him in fel.
You were still lucky starting then... I got pked my first day of UO on my way to Despise from Brit. Was on Atlantic before Europa shard was there. My first thought was... I want to do this as well...

About KR.. I wont start since its meaningless... We all know the rates on UO at moment.. and its going down even after KR. Many hold houses on active accounts.

I pked on a P 133mhz and i didnt lag. 28.8 modem.

Running a 3ghz 1gb ram, 10/10 optical fiber connection.. and I lag at times. ON A 2D GAME! ..

Back to KR... The client structure is ALOT better than 2d... the 2d was a mess from the start. The layout.. the looks of graphic.. KR is horrible. For all the items/monsters/players they got in UO.. They would have needed WAY longer to warp it to KR.. Its released too early.. and dont tell me all new games are released to early i know that. But KR is released already in alpha staged compared.

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Old 23rd November 2007, 12:51 AM   #9
 
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Re: Derision is just too darn easy.

Quote:
Anyway, without sweeping changes throughout the years, UO wouldn't be celebrating a ten year anniversary. It wouldn't have celebrated a seventh even.
Just as well, I could state that UO might have done even better had the devs not made such drastic changes, repelling many players who were unwilling to adapt. All in all, I can't prove my statement nor you yours, so it's entirely irrelevant.

Regardless, however, I will reiterate my original point, that simply improving upon a currently existing system, that is, to balance it, add to it, etc, without significantly altering its purpose or function is entirely possible. Furthermore, I will also state that by doing so, and maintaining a certain level of consistency, one can innovate while retaining the original feel, thus keeping the old and bringing the new.

Let's take the graphics for example since that is the main topic. I once made the argument (on a different forum) that the most absurd change in KR is the fact that headlesses appear to carry their heads, as oppose to 2D, where they do not carry the heads (the classic headless). Why the difference? Or better yet, why did it have to be different? Of course I got the typical irrelevant responses.... "Oh well I think it looks good".... etc, but my point remained neglected. Because you see, if they originally drew the KR headless as not having a head, I can guarantee you, every single person who likes the new headless would not have any problems. They wouldn't be complaining that the headless isn't carrying it's head.

If they drew the KR headless as not carrying its head, nobody would complain. Not me, nor people secretly wishing it did carry a head (because there would be none). Furthermore, if they redrew the headless at this moment, I'd be willing to bet that nobody would complain. Then you win over more people like me who want KR to feel more like 2D. That's win-win. Compromise. Consistency. It's a beautiful thing!

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Still we loom in the mists as the ages roll away,
And we say of our folk, "they are here!"
That they built us and they died and you'll not be knowing why,
Save we stand on the bare plains of Wiltshire.
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